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This article is skewed toward cheaper units.  Do your homework on brands and construction.  You won't find these problems in a Prevost, Country Coach, Foretravel, Bluebird, etc.  IMHO you'd be better off looking into a used unit from one of these brands than a new Class A.  Plus, you will be letting someone else take the hit on the major depreciation.  Our Country Coach (diesel pusher) is 15 years old   If we were to put it up for sale, someone would get a wonderful unit at a bargain price.

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I agree with most points in that article. Most RV manufacturers sling them together. A 100k toyhauler has no better QA/QC than a 15k TT. The message boards are littered with horror stories about brand new rigs. Some Class A manufacturers are better than others. I had a buddy drop huge $ on a pusher that was a lemon. He then traded it for a Zephr by Tiffin which seemed to be made much better.

Benefits of buying used are someone else has probably worked through all of the problems (unless they are dumping it), and they will take the big depreciation hit.

 

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21 hours ago, Littleolwoman.aka.Kristie said:

We were almost ready to pull the trigger and up grade to a Class A and then my husband came across this article. Seasoned rv owners, what are your thoughts? 

http://livingstingy.blogspot.com/2014/09/the-rv-industrys-dirty-litle-secret.html?m=1

Interesting article.  It's like everything else, the quality goes down but the price doesn't.

 

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The RV industry as a whole has pretty poor quality. Some of it comes from trying to keep their profit margins but a lot is also due to their labor structure. Many if not all pay on a piece rate for the job. This means many of the workers will rush through so they can go home or in the case of the Amish go work on their farms. This type of structure does tend to emphasize speed over quality and it shows. There are some manufacturers that generally have better quality than the rest but you pay for it and they tend to be somewhat limited in the models they offer. Even these can have issues as they all use the same suppliers for many of the components.

Whether you want to buy new or used is up to you. With a used unit you don't take the big depreciation hit and the manufacturing issues might have been resolved. On the other hand with a new unit you have to go through the new RV pains but you also know the history and if you do the repairs yourself know they were done to your liking. I pretty much go new as I'm one of those that rather know what the problems were and how they were handled. I also keep things and not turn them over every few years so the initial depreciation isn't a concern. 

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You don't buy an RV as a investment.  Everything goes down in value.  Some more than others.  While I agree with much of what the article writer described in his article, his recommendation was a Casita.  No way will that be comfortable for more than 1 person.  There are a few manufacturers that have an excellent reputation for quality but you will find that you will still have to do maintenance on all of them.  You will also have to recognize that you will pay for what you get.  There is one very large manufacturer that claims 80% of the RV market.  That is based on price not on quality.  The quality manufacturers do not have problems with delamination because they build a quality product using quality materials.  While an EPDM roof is guaranteed for 12 years it should last 20.  It will tear if you let a tree branch scrape across it.  Don't ask me how I know.  Many quality companies use fiberglass roofs and fiberglass front and rear caps.  The quality manufacturers for Class A's are Newmar, Tiffin, Winnebago and Fleetwood.  The next time you go camping look around and see what everyone else has.  The new ones are going to be different from the old ones.  The units still on the road after 10-20 years will most likely be the ones I mentioned.  But there are always exceptions.  The writer found a few really bad pictures and used them to slam the entire industry.  In most cases that's fair but not in all cases.  My current RV is a 2007 Newmar Baystar.  Its built on the same assembly line that their $1 million dollar Essex's are build on by the same people.  My unit is an entry level Class A with a Ford Chassis.  I never had a leak and the quality of the components are generally good but I still had to fix the hot water heater, the refrigerator and the automatic steps over the years.  If I had to do it all over again and I just might,  I would stick with a gas Class A with a full body paint job, Fiberglass Roof  and a residential refrigerator.  But units from those manufacturers with those features are not cheap. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

rv*& market

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3 hours ago, ImDownWithDisney said:

Look at how jayco slings their stuff together.

https://youtu.be/jXMJrRQ3SVk

That video has been sped up to fit a certain time constraint by a competitor and has been debunked. I've toured both the FW plant and the MH plant and it is nothing like that. 

We're on our 3rd JAYCO since 2001(put ovet 50,000 miles on each mh a 2001 and a 2008) and have about 15 000 on our 2015 FW. My problems have been caused by common components (Coleman, Carefree, Norcold ). JAYCO gives you a 2 yr warranty and had an A/C repaired AT THE FORT in 48 hrs, never had to move. Before those 3 had 5 STARCRAFT units since 1977 (now owned by JAYCO) and would gladly do it all over again.

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8 hours ago, Grumpy and Grandma said:

That video has been sped up to fit a certain time constraint by a competitor and has been debunked. I've toured both the FW plant and the MH plant and it is nothing like that. 

We're on our 3rd JAYCO since 2001(put ovet 50,000 miles on each mh a 2001 and a 2008) and have about 15 000 on our 2015 FW. My problems have been caused by common components (Coleman, Carefree, Norcold ). JAYCO gives you a 2 yr warranty and had an A/C repaired AT THE FORT in 48 hrs, never had to move. Before those 3 had 5 STARCRAFT units since 1977 (now owned by JAYCO) and would gladly do it all over again.

Glad you've had good luck. My best friend bought a new 2015 jayco travel trailer. It was junk. The roof leaked before he even used it. Interiors pieces fell apart. Total junk. He needed a 2 year warranty because it tore up all of the time. The dealer had it more than he did.

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It seems like whenever you buy an RV/TT you are playing Russian Roulette. How then do you move forward with a motorhome that cost $80,000+? You are basically taking out a second mortgage on a potential piece of junk. What made you take the plunge and blow caution to the wind?

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42 minutes ago, Littleolwoman.aka.Kristie said:

It seems like whenever you buy an RV/TT you are playing Russian Roulette. How then do you move forward with a motorhome that cost $80,000+? You are basically taking out a second mortgage on a potential piece of junk. What made you take the plunge and blow caution to the wind?

It's like any product you only hear the bad. Just like cars you always hear from the guy who got the "lemon", but rarely from the guy who got the " rose".  

You have to look at the brand's and the dealer's reputation.  A bad dealer is usually worse than a bad unit because they don't care about service after the sale.

 

 

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It seem anymore that it all comes down to luck with anything you buy, be it a refrigerator or RV.  We bought a new "cheap" TT (18,000.00) our friends bought a 34,000.00 TT, they are the same size but different floor plans. We both have had some issues with them fixed under warranty. One ours was a major problem with the floor in the slide warping. But they have had more major issues with their more expensive, "better built" trailer that though covered under warranty have not been resolved. Comes down to luck of the draw.

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52 minutes ago, Travisma said:

But whehter it's a $5.00 item or a $500K item, there should be pride in workmanship.  

Society as a whole has come to accept poor craftsmanship and short longevity on items, and just write it off as cheap Chinese junk.

Having a floor warp on an $18K investment is just crazy.

Exactly! 

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53 minutes ago, Littleolwoman.aka.Kristie said:

The other issue is speeding down the road at 70 miles per hour with nothing but a sheet of thin plywood and fiberglass between my family and the black top. The seat belts in these things are a joke. Any suggestions? 

Look at the mega class C coaches built on semi truck chassis. A friend of mine has one on a Freightliner chassis. The build quality is very good and they can be serviced at a lot more places in regards to the chassis. The manufacturers tend to be lower volume too. So quality is better on the living quarters 

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2 hours ago, Grumpy and Grandma said:

 A bad dealer is usually worse than a bad unit because they don't care about service after the sale.

 

 

This is what it all comes down to,  If a unit has problems and the dealer fixes them with out a ton of red tape and does it quickly the problems don't cause you as much headache.  But if you unit sits at the dealer for 3 months over the summer waiting for a simple warranty repair suddenly your wonderful camper becomes a POS.  

Case in point.  I took my 5er to a local dealer because the awning was starting to pull away from the side of the camper.  Dropped it off on a Tuesday afternoon.  That Friday I was given an estimate to repair it, and they suggested some touch up on the roof to add extra sealant to some openings.  I gave them the green light and hoped to have the camper back in 3 weeks.  To my surprise I received a call the very next Friday it was done and ready for pickup.  

Now my father inlaw took his class A to a different repair center (big name national sales center) to get a switch replaced in the dash for the self leveling system.  Its been there for 2 or 3 months with no contact from the repair center.

Guess where I'm shopping for my new 5er?

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It wasn't all that long ago, ok I'm getting old so everything seems like yesterday,  that the US auto industry had issues like the RV industry does. Although not as bad that included things like dealers not doing warranty work unless you bought your car at there. The only thing that fixed it was the Japanese resolving their quality issues and coming to the market with a better vehicle at a better price. Almost going out of business due to a better competitor is what forced the US companies to improve. It also forced the companies to get better control over their dealers and set customer service expectations. I don't think you will see major changes in the RV industry until something similar happens to force a change. Right now RV's are selling like hot cakes and as long as they continue to sell and warranty costs are within expectations you won't see a change. In fact I think RV owners, myself included, are our own worst enemy in the way we will fix things rather than take it the dealer under warranty. I also don't think you will see major improvements with dealers until the RV manufacturers take more control of how they operate but again I see nothing to incent them to do this. Even if the RV manufacturers had more control you still need to get the dealers to see service as a profit center to staffed and run as such (i.e. get rid of the backlogs and reliable scheduling).  

As for Class A options the only way I know of to get more substantial construction is to go with a travel bus/motor coach and outfit it yourself. One of my neighbors has a regional gospel group and that is what he did for their tour bus. I will say it is nicer than any of the Class A's I've seen on dealer lots but I'm sure it was a lot more than $80K. What I do is once we've decided on the models we would buy is to look at the trade and owner reviews, various forums and any other place that discusses the company and its products. Based on this I can get a feel for the types of issues people have, how long before major problems show up and how the company handles warranty work. After that I buy and hope for the best.

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31 minutes ago, keith_h said:

It wasn't all that long ago, ok I'm getting old so everything seems like yesterday,  that the US auto industry had issues like the RV industry does. Although not as bad that included things like dealers not doing warranty work unless you bought your car at there. The only thing that fixed it was the Japanese resolving their quality issues and coming to the market with a better vehicle at a better price. Almost going out of business due to a better competitor is what forced the US companies to improve. It also forced the companies to get better control over their dealers and set customer service expectations. I don't think you will see major changes in the RV industry until something similar happens to force a change. Right now RV's are selling like hot cakes and as long as they continue to sell and warranty costs are within expectations you won't see a change. In fact I think RV owners, myself included, are our own worst enemy in the way we will fix things rather than take it the dealer under warranty. I also don't think you will see major improvements with dealers until the RV manufacturers take more control of how they operate but again I see nothing to incent them to do this. Even if the RV manufacturers had more control you still need to get the dealers to see service as a profit center to staffed and run as such (i.e. get rid of the backlogs and reliable scheduling).  

As for Class A options the only way I know of to get more substantial construction is to go with a travel bus/motor coach and outfit it yourself. One of my neighbors has a regional gospel group and that is what he did for their tour bus. I will say it is nicer than any of the Class A's I've seen on dealer lots but I'm sure it was a lot more than $80K. What I do is once we've decided on the models we would buy is to look at the trade and owner reviews, various forums and any other place that discusses the company and its products. Based on this I can get a feel for the types of issues people have, how long before major problems show up and how the company handles warranty work. After that I buy and hope for the best.

We came across a Prevost that had been redone. It was awesome and definitely go me thinking about going the remodel route. I think what you said about checking forums and reviews is a good idea and definitely something I will look into. In the end however, no 2 rigs are built the same and everyone has horror stories. 

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1 hour ago, bdm said:

This is what it all comes down to,  If a unit has problems and the dealer fixes them with out a ton of red tape and does it quickly the problems don't cause you as much headache.  But if you unit sits at the dealer for 3 months over the summer waiting for a simple warranty repair suddenly your wonderful camper becomes a POS.  

Case in point.  I took my 5er to a local dealer because the awning was starting to pull away from the side of the camper.  Dropped it off on a Tuesday afternoon.  That Friday I was given an estimate to repair it, and they suggested some touch up on the roof to add extra sealant to some openings.  I gave them the green light and hoped to have the camper back in 3 weeks.  To my surprise I received a call the very next Friday it was done and ready for pickup.  

Now my father inlaw took his class A to a different repair center (big name national sales center) to get a switch replaced in the dash for the self leveling system.  Its been there for 2 or 3 months with no contact from the repair center.

Guess where I'm shopping for my new 5er?

Right! The dealer is a big deal when it comes to warranty work. We bought our Jayco in Michigan. Thankfully we haven't had any problems with it because we would have had to pull it back to Michigan for repairs. Newbie mistake for sure.

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8 minutes ago, Littleolwoman.aka.Kristie said:

We bought our Jayco in Michigan. Thankfully we haven't had any problems with it because we would have had to pull it back to Michigan for repairs.

Not really true. JAYCO works with numerous RV repair centers and mobile service providers, Camping Connections on 192 in Kissimmee being one of them for warranty work. They also have a facility in Myrtle Beach. 

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The dealers are the biggest problem!! I WILL NOT take my rig to a dealer for repair. I either do it myself, or if it is major, I'm making an appointment direct with the factory that is the current builder. (Dutchman was useless). Mine is long out of warranty, but I won't trust any service department that knows less than I do about my rig.

I actually did try a couple of service places when it was in warranty, for my hatch leak, and never got an actual resolution. It took a repair of my own design to solve the problem. (The factory now includes what I did as standard on their kitchen hatches.)

When I bought my unit, their "walkthough" checklist was about 3/4 of a page. My checklist was four pages long. When I did take it to another service place under warranty, I got blank stares.

I gave up at that point, and started relying on our owner's group on advice on repairs, and have had work done while at the factory rallies.

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  • 1 month later...

We have decided to go with an older rig. Sure it's not as nice as the new ones, but the price tag is over half that of a newer rig. We still aren't sure we are going to love Class A living so the cheaper price tag makes it an easier pill to swallow.  My thoughts were that if we really enjoyed it, we would rent out the used rig and buy a newer model in a few years. 

We plan to buy from a private seller in PA. We have talked to the guy and are scheduled to Skype a walk through tonight. We have researched all the appropriate questions to ask and seem satisfied with his answers. Any advice from fiends who have gone the same road?

We are 8.5 hours away so we really want  to be 99% sure it's a done deal before we hit the road. Has anyone had a camper shipped? 

As the rig is 38' in length. I am concerned about finding camping spots. Any other big riggers have advice?

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