Ram half ton diesel

[CakeHenn 4]

Not sure if this is the place to put this but if you have a travel trailer/pop up under say 7000 or 8000lbs...pretty much something that is half ton tow-able and are in the market for a new truck sometime in the next few years you might want to give the new Ram 1500 diesel a look...they say it's going to be coming out the 3rd quarter of this year. I guess a 2014.

Not too many specs out on this Truck yet but the new Jeep Grand Cherokee that is out or about to be out has some specs listed on the Jeep website...it's using the same diesel engine that the Ram will be using. They say it will get 30 mpg highway and give a range of 730 miles on a 24.6 gal tank. It will have class leading torque so towing anything that you would consider towing with a half ton would be great for this truck. Some may mistake this as a truck they can use to pull a bigger trailer or 5'er but keep in mind it's still just a half ton and like most other half tons it's payload capacity is going to be maxed out long before the towing capacity is even close to being maxed out. Most half tons with the bigger engines...you are looking at about 15 ave mpg and about 7-10 towing. I'm thinking this might give the same driver around 25 average and around 10-14 towing depending on the load. All and all even though diesel fuel costs (as of today when I passed a station) 44 cents more per gal the overall fuel savings will be significant. You still will have to weight the extra cost of the diesel engine which I'm guessing might be $2-4k more than the HEMI in the same truck...but then again you'll get that back and then some on the back end when you sell. Diesels are said to have greater longevity vs gas engines but you will pay higher maintenance costs. I still think for the right person that puts maybe more than the average mileage on their truck/year this could be great economical truck.

I love my Dmax but wish I had a half ton...however my trailer being at 35' and around 9300 loaded half tons are just maxed out on it. If we ever scale down I'll for sure consider this Dodge.

Regardless of what you think about Dodge this is a good thing for truck owners because it's going to push Ford/GM/Toyota etc to come up with more options. Ford kind of let the way IMO with the Eco Boost however I just know two people that have them and their actual MPG has been disappointing so far. But regardless at least Ford has put something out that gives half ton buyers some options and now with Dodge coming out with this the market looks even better.

[caveat lector 181]

Interesting, but I'll wait and see the execution. There was a guy in high school who dropped a Chevy V8 into his vw bug. Not sure why he did it other than "because he could". Not a lot of time went by until it ended up a pile of twisted metal in the junk yard.

[CakeHenn 4]

Well this is not the 6.7 liter cummins going into the 1500 it's a 3 liter engine so more size appropriate for good economy. From what I see the torque for the Jeep is 420 pounds...the Tundra is 400 followed by Eco Boost which is also around 420 I believe. So I'm thinking if the Ram is class leading it will be 420 or more.

[LONE-STAR 370]

I wish they would put a diesel in a jeep Wrangler. Its crazy that they don't. You can get them in Europe. Thats interesting about the ram though.

[DaveInTN 3,247]

I wish they would put a diesel in a jeep Wrangler. Its crazy that they don't. You can get them in Europe. Thats interesting about the ram though.

They practically put diesels in everything in Europe. Wish we'd get some of those vehicles.

[ftwildernessguy 778]

In a lighter truck, I really cant see the advantage with a diesel. And with all the emissions requirements now, I am not really thrilled with the newer Diesel engines. I hear way to many complaints. I'll stick with my 5.4l gasser in my 1/2 ton. As far as diesel cars, didn't VW try that with the Rabbit? Oh yeah, now that was a winner for them.

[alexwyattmommy 181]

I loved my turquoise blue Rabbit. It was gas because they didn't have a diesel on the lot when my Dad bought it new. I learned to drive in it, my little sister learned to drive in it and then she broke it by hitting a truck towing a boat. The truck won.

[DaveInTN 3,247]

I loved my turquoise blue Rabbit. It was gas because they didn't have a diesel on the lot when my Dad bought it new. I learned to drive in it, my little sister learned to drive in it and then she broke it by hitting a truck towing a boat. The truck won.

I had a blue Rabbit too! Mine was a gas powered one that I bought for $75 from the manager of a store I worked at. It died on him...towed it back to my house and got it running with a $3 part. You couldn't kill that thing.

My mom had a green Rabbit that was a diesel. No lie...it got 70 mpg. Of course, it was slow. I clocked 0-60 once at 53 seconds.

Once I was done with the blue Rabbit, my Dad used it to tool around on the farm. Unlike the pickup, the Rabbit could fit between the rows of grapes.

And hey, speaking of diesels...my mom also had a Ford Escort diesel back in the 80's. That was a great car that not many people remember. They used a Mazda engine in it that was reliable and a lot more powerful than the VW one. (We liked diesels as we had an underground tank of the stuff for the tractors).

Sorry....none of this has anything to do with Ram's. Back to the topic at hand.....

[CakeHenn 4]

In a lighter truck, I really cant see the advantage with a diesel. And with all the emissions requirements now, I am not really thrilled with the newer Diesel engines. I hear way to many complaints. I'll stick with my 5.4l gasser in my 1/2 ton. As far as diesel cars, didn't VW try that with the Rabbit? Oh yeah, now that was a winner for them.

You might be a little behind on the times with VW. They are putting them in most or all of their vehicles now...they still make more gas engines but the diesel ones are flying off the shelf now and probably a big reason why Ram in jumping in with this offering. The Passat diesel...which is probably the size of an Accord or Camry gets 43 MPG and has a range of 795 miles per tank.

http://web.vw.com/tdi-clean-diesel/?context=showroom

As far as you being unhappy with the newer diesels...I think you are right about the ones that came out after all the new environmental standards came out...the 07s and probably though 09 or later but the latest ones are getting pretty good again. But you said you can't see the advantage...I think the advantage should be clear...you are probably getting around what 15 ave mpg in your truck now...well this one will probably get you 25mpg and will also deliver better towing MPG. Now if you are not in the market for a new half ton then yes there would be no personal reason for you. Like I said I'm not in the market either. I'm a big fan of buying used vehicles so this is not something I would buy new but maybe a few years down the line. But keep in mind used diesels hold values much better than the gasser counterparts.

[DaveInTN 3,247]

The Passat diesel...which is probably the size of an Accord or Camry gets 43 MPG and has a range of 795 miles per tank.

And they make them right here in TN!

[CakeHenn 4]

I guy on a RV forum I look at made a post about his VW Touareg. He says he's getting 29 mpg going 78 mph and gets 14.5 mpg towing his 4000lb travel trailer. The diesel engine in the Tourareg is a 3.0 liter like the one that's in the Jeep and Ram....obviously it's a different engine and will have different specs but this does show some good economy coming from this one person.

My wife drives a 4 banger Rav4...great small SUV (if you can call it that) but it has worse MPG than this guys Touareg and it's smaller and has a much less powerful engine.

[Davydee 3]

In a lighter truck, I really cant see the advantage with a diesel. And with all the emissions requirements now, I am not really thrilled with the newer Diesel engines. I hear way to many complaints. I'll stick with my 5.4l gasser in my 1/2 ton. As far as diesel cars, didn't VW try that with the Rabbit? Oh yeah, now that was a winner for them.

With the smaller vehicles, are they using a different style or type of diesel emmisons equipment than what's being used on the 3/4 and above trucks? On ours, it's an active, heat the heck out of the exhaust to clean the diesel exhaust particulate filter to burn the "soot" off. I believe that the 2011s (and newer) use a passive process and only goes to an "active" mode when necessary. Maybe someone on the forum will know more and can tell me. Heaven forbid that you shut ours down or put it in neutral or park when it's actively cleaning that filter. If we do, the next time it cranks up (read "heat the exhaust back up") to clean that particulate filter, we leave a nice plume of smoke for about a minute. This from a vehicle that Ford Techs have, over and over, again, state meets all 2007 Diesel EPA specs. Secondly, when ours starts to clean, it feels like you just drove into a 60 mph head wind when traveling down the interstate. I can't believe anyone would be happy with a 1/2 ton doing that. I'm sure ain't happy in a F450 when it does it. Next, when it goes to clean that particulate filter, we lose somewhere between 0.3 to 0,5 mpg. That probably doesn't bother someone getting 30.0 mpg, but we're getting 8.4 mpg. Lastly, the "parameters" for that thing to start to clean the diesel particulate filter align almost exactly to when we want to shut the engine off (and align perfectly when I need to go to the restroom). I'd love to hear how all that compares to what you guys in the small vehicles with diesels are experiencing. David

[LONE-STAR 370]

With the smaller vehicles, are they using a different style or type of diesel emmisons equipment than what's being used on the 3/4 and above trucks? On ours, it's an active, heat the heck out of the exhaust to clean the diesel exhaust particulate filter to burn the "soot" off. I believe that the 2011s (and newer) use a passive process and only goes to an "active" mode when necessary. Maybe someone on the forum will know more and can tell me. Heaven forbid that you shut ours down or put it in neutral or park when it's actively cleaning that filter. If we do, the next time it cranks up (read "heat the exhaust back up") to clean that particulate filter, we leave a nice plume of smoke for about a minute. This from a vehicle that Ford Techs have, over and over, again, state meets all 2007 Diesel EPA specs. Secondly, when ours starts to clean, it feels like you just drove into a 60 mph head wind when traveling down the interstate. I can't believe anyone would be happy with a 1/2 ton doing that. I'm sure ain't happy in a F450 when it does it. Next, when it goes to clean that particulate filter, we lose somewhere between 0.3 to 0,5 mpg. That probably doesn't bother someone getting 30.0 mpg, but we're getting 8.4 mpg. Lastly, the "parameters" for that thing to start to clean the diesel particulate filter align almost exactly to when we want to shut the engine off (and align perfectly when I need to go to the restroom). I'd love to hear how all that compares to what you guys in the small vehicles with diesels are experiencing. David

I have a 2012 f350 and the regens aren't bad. I only have 5,800 miles on it but I really like it so far. We have had a 2000 ford 7.3 and a 2005 6.0 and 2 dodge 5.9's a 01 and a 05. So far my 6.7 is better in every way. Except the 01 dodge would do 22 mpg highway and my 6.7 is doing 19 mpg both all highway. I skipped the 6.4. I loved the ford part of my 05 but not the international motor. So I waited for Ford to make there own motor.

[ftwildernessguy 778]

I'm thinking when the 2005 f150 bites the bullet, I'll go with another with the Ecoboost engine.

[caveat lector 181]

With the smaller vehicles, are they using a different style or type of diesel emmisons equipment than what's being used on the 3/4 and above trucks? On ours, it's an active, heat the heck out of the exhaust to clean the diesel exhaust particulate filter to burn the "soot" off. I believe that the 2011s (and newer) use a passive process and only goes to an "active" mode when necessary. Maybe someone on the forum will know more and can tell me. Heaven forbid that you shut ours down or put it in neutral or park when it's actively cleaning that filter. If we do, the next time it cranks up (read "heat the exhaust back up") to clean that particulate filter, we leave a nice plume of smoke for about a minute. This from a vehicle that Ford Techs have, over and over, again, state meets all 2007 Diesel EPA specs. Secondly, when ours starts to clean, it feels like you just drove into a 60 mph head wind when traveling down the interstate. I can't believe anyone would be happy with a 1/2 ton doing that. I'm sure ain't happy in a F450 when it does it. Next, when it goes to clean that particulate filter, we lose somewhere between 0.3 to 0,5 mpg. That probably doesn't bother someone getting 30.0 mpg, but we're getting 8.4 mpg. Lastly, the "parameters" for that thing to start to clean the diesel particulate filter align almost exactly to when we want to shut the engine off (and align perfectly when I need to go to the restroom). I'd love to hear how all that compares to what you guys in the small vehicles with diesels are experiencing. David

On my '11 F250 6.7, I do notice the mileage ticking down as you've noted. Other than that, I haven't had many of the thing you've noted. I only have 30k on it, so maybe those things will manifest themselves as my miles climb. So far, I love this truck (my first diesel).

[CakeHenn 4]

What are these regens I hear people talking about. Is this maintenance you have to do or is it just a process the truck does on it's own. I guess that's just an issue with the newer trucks.

[Davydee 3]

What are these regens I hear people talking about. Is this maintenance you have to do or is it just a process the truck does on it's own. I guess that's just an issue with the newer trucks.

Unsure what Dodge did with the Cummins engine, but GM and Ford added a diesel particulate filter to catch the soot, etc from the diesel exhaust. This was done to meet the 2007 Diesel Emissions requirement from EPA. Depending on how much "pollutants or soot" an engine puts out, that filter will clog and need to be cleaned. Ford and GM started with a system that heats the exhaust to extreme temperatures to burn the "soot" off that filter. This is a common experience. When we purchased our truck in Dec 2008, the particulate filter wouldn't need to be manually removed & cleaned or replaced until about 125,000 miles (and of course, your mileage may vary.) These "regens" were to take care of you until then.

For the 2008-2010 Fords and, I think, GM, that's an active process - you have to burn it off to clean the soot off until the filter needs replacing. Beginning in 2011 model trucks, GM and Ford added urea (I think) as an additional fluid that allows for passive cleanings and reduced the need for active (think burning) diesel particulate filter cleanings. We have a 2009 F450, so we got the active only version of cleaning. I have no idea what Dodge is using though I'd speculate it's the same as the 2011 GM and Ford trucks.

The problem with the active cleanings is that unless you've added an aftermarket reader of some type or you're an extremely sensitive person, knowing when a 2008-2010 Ford is cleaning the filter is invisible to you. And shutting the engine off while it is cleaning leaves you with an extremely hot exhaust and a pool of fuel in the system that, when the system starts to clean the next time, it has to burn off and in doing so leaves you with a nice plume of smoke for a minute or so. To the causal observer, one would think that's what all this exhaust cleaning process is suppose to stop - SMOKE!.

Yes, Ford does have a way for you to check, but it's a systems check and takes a minute or so to run and the check for cleaning that exhaust filter is the last item in the list that it checks. When our truck was new, Ford told you in the drivers info screen that it was cleaning and that statement stayed on until the process was finished cleaning. You knew to wait until it was finished. That statement seemed to always post in ours when I needed to take a restroom break.

Now, time has passed and Ford has made several "Customer Satisfaction" updates for the 2008-2010 trucks to the computer programming and the statement that the filter is cleaning now stays only 2 seconds. My personal scan isn't that quick. So now it's easier to unintentionally shut the truck off when its cleaning. Yes you can add a reader that will tell you. Unfortunately, that can be seen as a "mod" by some Ford dealers which invalidates your warranty, and...well you get the idea. The ideal is to only do only highway driving with the 2008-2010 Fords which allows for quick and efficient cleaning of the particulate filter. Stop-n-go city driving makes it harder for the system to clean the filter, makes the process run longer, etc.

FYI: Currently, I'm sitting with our trailer at the Seabee base in Port Hueneme, CA. And they've got several 2008-2010 Fords with this exhaust cleaning system on base. Currently, when they know the truck is or has recently cleaned the diesel particulate filter, they can't park the truck on grass, within 50 ft of a fuel storage tank nor in any garage. One petty officer kindly warned me when we checked on-board the base so I wouldn't unintentionally do something dangerous with our truck.

David

[caveat lector 181]

The stuff is all automatic on my '11. So far, no matter when I shut it off, I have never seen a bug bomb coming out of my exhaust pipe.

[LONE-STAR 370]

Dodge starting in 07 with the 6.7 also has to do the regens. For 2013 the now called Ram trucks with diesels will also use urea like Ford and GM. On the 11 and up Ford if you drop below 30 mph it turns off the regen. The longer it stays in regen the longer it will be before it regens again.

[Davydee 3]

Excellent! Sounds like they're learning. Now if they could just give us that same diesel/electric that the trains advertise they have that can move a ton of stuff 500 miles on one gallon of fuel. Lets see...for us that means about 14 gals of fuel to go 500 miles for our rig would turn out to be about 35.7 mpg. Now that definetely beats 8.4 mpg! (I know, I know...No, I haven't weighted a locomotive lately.) :) David

[LONE-STAR 370]

Back in 2000 I read a article that in 2002 dodge was going to release a diesel elec. 1 ton. It was going to get 30 mpg and was going to be able to power you RV when overnighting. But as you know it never came.

[Davydee 3]

Oh, but that would've been sooooo sweet!

[Tiger Bait 0]

Ford really set the bar with 1/2 ton trucks and the Ecoboost...I see them all over the campgrounds towing lightweight TT's.

Gonna be interesting how well 1/2 ton truck buyers see into the Dodge diesel vs Ecoboost!

I'm a Duramax guy, 5'ver too big for 1/2 ton market but always interested in what the truck market comes up with.