Travisma 1,317 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Fiat/Dodge has been hit with a hefty fine, and ordered to offer buybacks on a slew of vehicles. Fiat Chrysler faces record fine over recalls, must offer to buy back 500,000 Ram pickup trucks DETROIT – Fiat Chrysler must offer to buy back from customers more than 500,000 Ram pickup trucks and other vehicles in the biggest such action in U.S. history as part of a costly deal with safety regulators to settle legal problems in about two dozen recalls. The Ram pickups, which are the company's top-selling vehicle, have defective steering parts that can cause drivers to lose control. Some previous repairs have been unsuccessful, so Fiat Chrysler agreed to the buyback, according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. Owners also have the option of getting them repaired, the agency said in documents released Sunday. The older Jeeps have fuel tanks located behind the rear axle, with little to shield them in a rear crash. They can rupture and spill gasoline, causing a fire. At least 75 people have died in crash-related fires, although Fiat Chrysler maintains they are as safe as comparable vehicles from the same era.Both the Jeep and Ram measures are part of a larger settlement between the government and the automaker over allegations of misconduct in 23 recalls covering more than 11 million vehicles. Besides the civil penalty, which was reported Saturday by The Associated Press, Fiat Chrysler agreed to an independent recall monitor and strict federal oversight. It's another step in NHTSA's effort to right itself after being criticized for lapses in some highly-publicized safety recalls. Models included in the buyback offer are certain Ram 1500s from 2009 to 2012; the Ram 1500 Mega Cab 4 by 4 from 2008; and the Ram 2500 4 by 4, 3500 4 by 4, 4500 4 by 4, and 5500 4 by 4, all from 2008 through 2012. Also part of the offer are 2009 Chrysler Aspen and Dodge Durango SUVs and the Dodge Dakota pickup from 2009 through 2011. I remember seeing in another post about some Rams getting the death wobble. Guess someone finally listened. My 2006 has a noisy front end with only 61K miles on it. Wonder if they will eventually include older models. There is also another recall not mentioned in here about seat/shoulder belts locking in place on Rams. My 2006 did that to my daughter the other night and my granddaughter sitting next to her had to release her. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keith_h 420 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 The defective steering in the settlement is the so called death wobble. My understanding is it is do to undersized components in steering and suspension components including some of the frame mounting points. For the most part it isn't fixable using factory parts and is what led to the redesigned suspension in the 2013's. I have heard some people have resolved it by going to non-stock aftermarket parts but that can be an expensive proposition for the owner for what is really a manufacturer problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rtguy007 74 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 There is another recall for 2013-2015's. Or I should say 2 recalls. One is for a stereo security vulnerability with uconnect. You can download a new version of the software to correct it from the uconnect site. The other is for an airbag issue with both front and side impact airbags. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Travisma 1,317 Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 There is another recall for 2013-2015's. Or I should say 2 recalls. One is for a stereo security vulnerability with uconnect. You can download a new version of the software to correct it from the uconnect site. The other is for an airbag issue with both front and side impact airbags.Yeah that u-connect one just blew up in their face last week with those white hat hackers disrupting their friends car while he was driving it. Personally, I think they were jackasses for doing it while he was on an open road with traffic around. They should have done it on a closed course. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rtguy007 74 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 There is another recall for 2013-2015's. Or I should say 2 recalls. One is for a stereo security vulnerability with uconnect. You can download a new version of the software to correct it from the uconnect site. The other is for an airbag issue with both front and side impact airbags. Yeah that u-connect one just blew up in their face last week with those white hat hackers disrupting their friends car while he was driving it. Personally, I think they were jackasses for doing it while he was on an open road with traffic around. They should have done it on a closed course. This isn't the first time they did it. The same guys tore apart a volt and a tesla. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Travisma 1,317 Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 This isn't the first time they did it. The same guys tore apart a volt and a tesla.Hmmm, missed those ones. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
momof3kids-Yvonne 594 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Counting my blessings that we did not buy any of these vehicles when eyeing them on Autotrader. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rtguy007 74 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 This isn't the first time they did it. The same guys tore apart a volt and a tesla. Hmmm, missed those ones. They are older and not well known outside of the hacking community. I knew a guy who had a volt and we messed around with it using their vulnerabilities. The guy I knew that had the volt also knew these guys. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
twiceblessed....nacole 433 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Saw this earlier and sent it to Tom.... we're looking at a Dodge 2500 this week, but I cannot remember the year. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rtguy007 74 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Saw this earlier and sent it to Tom.... we're looking at a Dodge 2500 this week, but I cannot remember the year. If it is a 2013 you are ok. It is only the trucks that have the Internet connect version of uconnect. In 2013, it was only available on a 1500. You can tell if it has this option by looking at the rear view mirror. It will have some buttons like emergency and help (kind of like onstar) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keith_h 420 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Anything connected to the Internet has the potential to be hacked. It's just plain dumb to have things connected that really have no need to. It might seem wonderful to be able to control your furnace from your smart phone or lock all of the doors. That is until a mischievous kid turns off your heat one winter while you are away for the weekend or a burglar using Google Street View to case your house turns off the alarm system and unlocks the doors. The same goes with cars as these hacker have shown. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Travisma 1,317 Posted July 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Anything connected to the Internet has the potential to be hacked. It's just plain dumb to have things connected that really have no need to. It might seem wonderful to be able to control your furnace from your smart phone or lock all of the doors. That is until a mischievous kid turns off your heat one winter while you are away for the weekend or a burglar using Google Street View to case your house turns off the alarm system and unlocks the doors. The same goes with cars as these hacker have shown.Reminds me of an old Sci Fi book I read. An alien energy cloud arrived at Earth and sucked up any electrical energy. Only things that would work was stuff using fire, so steam locomotives came back, cars were converted to run on steam powered engines, etc. The show Fallen Skies has the same sort of premise. They can keep the old cars running, but an EMP blast killed all of the newer computerized vehicles. They showed years ago how someone driving down the highway was able to bluejack tons of Bluetooth devices in other cars and they drove by collecting all sorts of data. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
djsamuel 322 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 The defective steering in the settlement is the so called death wobble. My understanding is it is do to undersized components in steering and suspension components including some of the frame mounting points. For the most part it isn't fixable using factory parts and is what led to the redesigned suspension in the 2013's. I have heard some people have resolved it by going to non-stock aftermarket parts but that can be an expensive proposition for the owner for what is really a manufacturer problem. The defective steering is the tie rod issue on some of the HD Rams. The bulk of the recall and the buybacks are the ram 1500, 2008 - 2012 for the pinion nut recall. I don't get that one. I had the pinion nut recall done a year and a half ago, and so have 60% of the other Ram 1500 owners to which this applies. The remaining 40% have not pursued the recall and the NHTSA says that Ram was not aggressive enough going after those who did not get it performed. I don't quite get that. Chrysler was slow with the parts on the recalls, especially as they were trying to recover and re-establish their supply line. However this is WAY overblown. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
djsamuel 322 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Yeah that u-connect one just blew up in their face last week with those white hat hackers disrupting their friends car while he was driving it. Personally, I think they were jackasses for doing it while he was on an open road with traffic around. They should have done it on a closed course. It is important to remember that this "hack" was done under a grant from the government. In addition, they worked with Chrysler while they reverse engineered the Cherokee. Chrysler already had a software update ready before this was publicized and they also closed the network port inadvertently left open by Sprint. The two guys who hacked the Cherokee verified that the hack will no longer work even if the cars are not updated, yet Chrysler more completely removed the vulnerability via the update (issued as a recall). It is also important to note that the hacking of the friend's car was really a controlled test where the author for Wired magazine drove the Cherokee which was owned by one of the hackers. What is lost in some of the hype is the fact that the most dangerous thing was turning off the vehicle on the highway (stupid). The driver could have restarted the car by hitting the start button to shut down the system and then restarting the car. In addition, the claims on the news that they could take over the car's steering failed to mention that control of the steering could only be accomplished if the vehicle was driving in reverse at less than 1MPH. They hacked into the automatic parking feature and that is how they controlled the steering. Many of the car magazines and web sites stressed that this hack was very specific to that ONE Cherokee due to the information needed, and would not be possible on a widespread basis even without any updates or network connections. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rtguy007 74 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 Anything connected to the Internet has the potential to be hacked. It's just plain dumb to have things connected that really have no need to. It might seem wonderful to be able to control your furnace from your smart phone or lock all of the doors. That is until a mischievous kid turns off your heat one winter while you are away for the weekend or a burglar using Google Street View to case your house turns off the alarm system and unlocks the doors. The same goes with cars as these hacker have shown. Yeah that u-connect one just blew up in their face last week with those white hat hackers disrupting their friends car while he was driving it. Personally, I think they were jackasses for doing it while he was on an open road with traffic around. They should have done it on a closed course. It is important to remember that this "hack" was done under a grant from the government. In addition, they worked with Chrysler while they reverse engineered the Cherokee. Chrysler already had a software update ready before this was publicized and they also closed the network port inadvertently left open by Sprint. The two guys who hacked the Cherokee verified that the hack will no longer work even if the cars are not updated, yet Chrysler more completely removed the vulnerability via the update (issued as a recall). It is also important to note that the hacking of the friend's car was really a controlled test where the author for Wired magazine drove the Cherokee which was owned by one of the hackers. What is lost in some of the hype is the fact that the most dangerous thing was turning off the vehicle on the highway (stupid). The driver could have restarted the car by hitting the start button to shut down the system and then restarting the car. In addition, the claims on the news that they could take over the car's steering failed to mention that control of the steering could only be accomplished if the vehicle was driving in reverse at less than 1MPH. They hacked into the automatic parking feature and that is how they controlled the steering. Many of the car magazines and web sites stressed that this hack was very specific to that ONE Cherokee due to the information needed, and would not be possible on a widespread basis even without any updates or network connections. 100% agree. I deal with this type of crap on an hourly basis. If you hook your network devices to the internet, you are asking for issues. Sure there are thousands of other ways to be compromised or hacked. The issue is we want the convenience as a society. The trade off is to get products to the market quicker, basic security measures in software coding are left out or overlooked. This is a very common occurance. Long story short....if it is connected to the cloud, it is in jeopardy of being compromised. If it is stored in the cloud, you have no control over YOUR data. Yes that includes everyone with a blasted iphone/ipad and anyone running linux. Anything can be hacked and you are foolish to think it cant. You want to keep your data and privacy safe, get off of social networks and stop putting your photos, videos, document backups, etc on free storage services like dropbox. It is freakishly scary what you can find out about people using the internet. It is even more concerning how much of their personal data anyone can get access to. I could go on and on but my non disclosure from work prevents me from talking in detail on what I see and what is out there. All I can say is that most things are better left off of the Internet. OK.......I am getting off my soap box. djsamuel 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Humphrey Bear…Rob 42 Posted July 28, 2015 Report Share Posted July 28, 2015 I traded my 2013 that death wobbled at 21k miles for a 2015 Chevy - I know I won't be able to recoup my losses, but good riddance... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Travisma 1,317 Posted July 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 I traded my 2013 that death wobbled at 21k miles for a 2015 Chevy - I know I won't be able to recoup my losses, but good riddance...If you sold it at a loss you may be able to recoup some of it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bhall 115 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 I traded my 2013 that death wobbled at 21k miles for a 2015 Chevy - I know I won't be able to recoup my losses, but good riddance... We need pics! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
twiceblessed....nacole 433 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Okay... so now I'm worried about the 2013 we're going to look at (even though it's not part of the recall). Found a Ford F250 that I like... but even IF we could get the dealer to come down, it would still be $5k more than the Dodge. Upsetting.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ependydad...Doug 176 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Okay... so now I'm worried about the 2013 we're going to look at (even though it's not part of the recall). Found a Ford F250 that I like... but even IF we could get the dealer to come down, it would still be $5k more than the Dodge. Upsetting.... I own a 2012 Ram that is right in the midst of this. I'd buy another Ram without concern. djsamuel 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stacktester 78 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 I've got a 13 Ram 2500. Not seeing it in the recall. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Travisma 1,317 Posted July 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Okay... so now I'm worried about the 2013 we're going to look at (even though it's not part of the recall). Found a Ford F250 that I like... but even IF we could get the dealer to come down, it would still be $5k more than the Dodge. Upsetting....Depending on who you talk to, you are going to hear about issues or praises with every brand, model, and year that someone has owned. There are good trucks, and there are lemons, just like everything you purchase Users may have identical trucks one will be a gem, and the other a turd. Sounds like you are stressing out. Find something you like, purchase it, and hope for the best. Unless you purchase brand new, you are probably going to incur some sort of repair costs sooner than later. I just got rid of a 2002 Ram 2 door with a 6 cylinder and 160,000 miles. Bought a 2006 4 door with 60,000 miles and an 8 cylinder. Already had to repair the AC, and the front end has a lot more noises coming from it than my 02 ever did. But I'm happy that I have a newer vehicle and 4 doors. It's a crap shoot no matter what you purchase. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
twiceblessed....nacole 433 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Yes..yes I am stressed out. This truck search has been in a huge pain in the butt! A tremendous headache. Especially now that we've sold Tom's car and we're down to the Armada only (which means I truly am a "stay at home" mom :) ). The supply for decently priced diesels (a model without a history of huge problems) is very low and someone always seems to beat us to the punch. We were suppose to look at a Dodge this week...but not only are the repairs not fully done, but now the owner/dealership is reconsidering their price (I guess they've received lots of interest). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MacDR 1 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 A Greetings from Wisconsin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
djsamuel 322 Posted July 29, 2015 Report Share Posted July 29, 2015 Yes..yes I am stressed out. This truck search has been in a huge pain in the butt! A tremendous headache. Especially now that we've sold Tom's car and we're down to the Armada only (which means I truly am a "stay at home" mom :) ). The supply for decently priced diesels (a model without a history of huge problems) is very low and someone always seems to beat us to the punch. We were suppose to look at a Dodge this week...but not only are the repairs not fully done, but now the owner/dealership is reconsidering their price (I guess they've received lots of interest). Go ahead and look at the Dodge. My Ram is one of the ones in the buyback, and there is no way I would give it back (unless they wanted to really give me a great deal). The truck is great, and the recall was done a year and a half ago. Much of this is punishment for a slow response to recalls, but in reality most of it is not deserved. The pinion nut recall behind the Ram 1500 buyback offer has been available for some time, but I guess the government feels Chrysler was not aggressive enough with people who failed to get the recall done. Again, I wouldn't worry about the recalls, especially with the truck you're looking at. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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