Disney To Build More Resorts

[AuburnJen 777]

Thanks to Chip and Co for this article.  Disney has announced that they are planning to build more resorts in the future.  It looks like the Caribbean Beach and Contemporary are getting more DVC, because you can't have enough DVC, right?

More details later when Bob Iger announces definites.

http://www.chipandco.com/disney-announces-plans-build-resorts-future-253089/

photo credit: chipandco.com

[Beckers 1,136]

At some point isn't the DVD demand going to pop? 

[AuburnJen 777]

you would think, but they see dollar signs, so I guess not

 

I would like to see a whole new resort personally

[Beckers 1,136]

Me too, just not deluxe because I'm too cheap lol. 

I'm not sure what theme I would like either. 

[GaDawgFan.....Kelly 799]

I don't get DVC at CBR. Isn't the whole point of DVC being able to stay in deluxe accommodations? 

[Tri-Circle-D 2,059]

14 hours ago, GaDawgFan.....Kelly said:

I don't get DVC at CBR. Isn't the whole point of DVC being able to stay in deluxe accommodations? 

I don't get it either, but they have enough space there to make a separate, self contained, DVC resort with its own deluxe amenities.

If they do go forward with this, then I view it as a possible test for doing the same thing at Fort Wilderness some day.

TCD

[Avatab.... Steve 124]

At the end of this process, it will be like trying to cram 10 pounds of you-know-what into a 5 pound bag.  The resorts exist to service the customers of the Parks. Until there is more capacity in the Parks they will just continue to get more and more crowded on more and more days. There is already almost no "off-season" anymore.

Disney has already been experimenting with controlling demand, how much more crowd-shifting can they do?

I cannot believe that they haven't considered building in Texas or another part of the USA to serve the obvious demand that exists. I know that's risky and it's easier to kick the can down the road and continue milking their already existing cash-cow, but how much longer can they keep doing that?

 

[PghBob 31]

This DVC member thinks he knows at least one reason why Disney is expanding its offerings.  DVC members pay for the buildings no matter who stays there.  Our annual fees include pro rata share of replacing carpet, furnishings, infrastructure, property taxes, and even the roofs.  So, Disney's operating cost and upkeep for each structure is dramatically reduced.  And, in terms of moola, Disney doesn't care who is forking out the cash for the nightly room rate, DVC or not.  So, when a DVC property is compared to straight out Disney property ownership, DVC should provide a larger net income to the company.  Disclosure - I don't know anything about properties other than my own.

[mouseketab.....Carol 1,261]

 

On 11/11/2016 at 1:06 PM, Avatab.... Steve said:

At the end of this process, it will be like trying to cram 10 pounds of you-know-what into a 5 pound bag.  The resorts exist to service the customers of the Parks. Until there is more capacity in the Parks they will just continue to get more and more crowded on more and more days. There is already almost no "off-season" anymore.

Disney has already been experimenting with controlling demand, how much more crowd-shifting can they do?

I cannot believe that they haven't considered building in Texas or another part of the USA to serve the obvious demand that exists. I know that's risky and it's easier to kick the can down the road and continue milking their already existing cash-cow, but how much longer can they keep doing that?

 

Honestly, the onsite guests are still a small part of the overall crowds at the parks. There are 100s of offsite hotels all over Orlando, and many thousands of guests stay in those offsite hotels and bus or drive into the parks. Especially Europeans. On my one offsite stay without a car, there were many UK visitors on the bus with me each day.

[Avatab.... Steve 124]

11 hours ago, mouseketab.....Carol said:

 

Honestly, the onsite guests are still a small part of the overall crowds at the parks. There are 100s of offsite hotels all over Orlando, and many thousands of guests stay in those offsite hotels and bus or drive into the parks. Especially Europeans. On my one offsite stay without a car, there were many UK visitors on the bus with me each day.

 

I had always thought that it was a bigger portion of total park visitors that stayed on property. Say maybe 50 percent?  I had an idea that of the other 50 percent that maybe 20 percent or so were locals or day-trippers, leaving 30 percent or so as staying locally.

I have no idea where I got those figures, if you are right then they are way off....

One thing is for sure, if Disney builds a new resort close to 100 percent of its guests will be going to one of the parks.  If a non Disney resort is built off-property it would be a lesser percentage, but how much I am not sure. Maybe a mix of people going to Disney, Universal, Seaworld, etc.

The big question is whether Disney's adding new resorts without also expanding the parks will further drive up attendance numbers at the existing parks or will it just steal guests from off-site resorts that were going to go to the parks anyway?

 

[h2odivers...Ray 952]

On 11/10/2016 at 6:50 PM, Beckers said:

At some point isn't the DVD demand going to pop? 

I don't get it either. Excluding DVC properties,  timeshare properties have basically no resale value.  Just go on eBay and look at completed listings. 

You can basically get a timeshare for free. You just have to take over the annnual fees.   

[h2odivers...Ray 952]

12 hours ago, mouseketab.....Carol said:

 

Honestly, the onsite guests are still a small part of the overall crowds at the parks. There are 100s of offsite hotels all over Orlando, and many thousands of guests stay in those offsite hotels and bus or drive into the parks. Especially Europeans. On my one offsite stay without a car, there were many UK visitors on the bus with me each day.

 

1 hour ago, Avatab.... Steve said:

 

I had always thought that it was a bigger portion of total park visitors that stayed on property. Say maybe 50 percent?  I had an idea that of the other 50 percent that maybe 20 percent or so were locals or day-trippers, leaving 30 percent or so as staying locally.

I have no idea where I got those figures, if you are right then they are way off....

One thing is for sure, if Disney builds a new resort close to 100 percent of its guests will be going to one of the parks.  If a non Disney resort is built off-property it would be a lesser percentage, but how much I am not sure. Maybe a mix of people going to Disney, Universal, Seaworld, etc.

The big question is whether Disney's adding new resorts without also expanding the parks will further drive up attendance numbers at the existing parks or will it just steal guests from off-site resorts that were going to go to the parks anyway?

 

According to touringplans.com. There are 30k onsite hotel rooms at WDW. This includes DVC rooms, but not the almost 800 camping sites at FW.   And there are 60k offsite hotels rooms.  This includes Kissimmee and international drive-universal studios area hotels & timeshare rooms.   

I once heard that an average of 120,000 to 140,000 visit WDW parks everyday.   (Approx 50,000,000 visitors per year)

if you make the assumption that each room has 2 or 3 people per night that would equate to 60,000 to 90,000 people staying onsite each day. 

 

That would mean almost 1/2 to 3/4 of the guest at Disney parks are staying onsite.  

 

Would that mean if they add more onsite rooms the daily park attendance would increase?    I don't know but I would think it would.    (My $.02 cents)

 

source : https://touringplans.com/walt-disney-world/hotels/number-rooms

[GaDawgFan.....Kelly 799]

They are expanding the parks though. They built the new part of Fantasyland, and Avatarland opens this summer. Then the DHS stuff will open, hopefully before I retire! 

[Beckers 1,136]

Yeah but they are adding a whopping 2 rides to AK and from my understanding only 1 will be a family ride (so I'm taking this to mean it's like Small World so no restrictions) and the other will have a height restriction.  So more people but not much to do.

 

or will the adding of rooms just shift where people stay. So it's not really more people coming to the parks just more people on property instead of staying down the road?

[GaDawgFan.....Kelly 799]

1 minute ago, Beckers said:

Yeah but they are adding a whopping 2 rides to AK and from my understanding only 1 will be a family ride (so I'm taking this to mean it's like Small World so no restrictions) and the other will have a height restriction.  So more people but not much to do.

 

or will the adding of rooms just shift where people stay. So it's not really more people coming to the parks just more people on property instead of staying down the road?

The moderate resorts pretty frequently have little availability, so I think they could shift some people. 

[mouseketab.....Carol 1,261]

OK, yeah, I guess the last time I saw stats to what I was trying to defend was a few years ago. Disney has added rooms, while now that I think about, there are lots of empty ghosts of hotels in Kissimmee and around Orlando, so maybe the tide has turned.

[Travisma 1,317]

11 hours ago, mouseketab.....Carol said:

OK, yeah, I guess the last time I saw stats to what I was trying to defend was a few years ago. Disney has added rooms, while now that I think about, there are lots of empty ghosts of hotels in Kissimmee and around Orlando, so maybe the tide has turned.

It seems like it must be less expensive for companies to start fresh and build new hotels than it is to go buy a vacant one and renovate it.  Same thing with stores and office buildings unless they are on a really good piece of property.  In Tampa we have loads of empty office buildings sitting around while 2 miles away they are building new ones.

[h2odivers...Ray 952]

11 hours ago, mouseketab.....Carol said:

OK, yeah, I guess the last time I saw stats to what I was trying to defend was a few years ago. Disney has added rooms, while now that I think about, there are lots of empty ghosts of hotels in Kissimmee and around Orlando, so maybe the tide has turned.

I wonder how many first time visitors stay on property vs off?

and how many return visitors stay on site vs off site?

 

We would love to stay onsite every time but for me and my family we stay offsite only for the substantial savings compared to staying on site.    

 

Example we will be 4 adults and 2 kids staying at Wyndham bonnet creek dec 24-31 in a 3 bedroom condo for $1799. 

 

A family suite at ASMusic is $3132. And that room wouldn't work for us since it's not two couple and two kids.  

 

We have, in the past done split stays. One week offsite and then one week onsite.  We hit the parks hard the first week while staying off property and that way we can enjoy the onsite resort more our second week. 

[keith_h 420]

19 minutes ago, Travisma said:

It seems like it must be less expensive for companies to start fresh and build new hotels than it is to go buy a vacant one and renovate it.  Same thing with stores and office buildings unless they are on a really good piece of property.  In Tampa we have loads of empty office buildings sitting around while 2 miles away they are building new ones.

Another thing that can result in derelict property is the owners purposely leaving it empty to prevent competition after building a new facility. Walmart is the most visible user of this strategy but many other companies use it.

[h2odivers...Ray 952]

11 hours ago, mouseketab.....Carol said:

OK, yeah, I guess the last time I saw stats to what I was trying to defend was a few years ago. Disney has added rooms, while now that I think about, there are lots of empty ghosts of hotels in Kissimmee and around Orlando, so maybe the tide has turned.

Also. I don't think building more hotels whether onsite or offsite will increase how many visitors come to Orlando.  I think the economy effects that more than the number of rooms  

I do think building onsite hotels will increase crownd levels at WDW parks. 

[caveat lector 181]

I think that Disney is selling an experience. At some point, when all the rides have TSM type waits, that will disincent visitors.  I don't know what that point is. I don't personally mind the ridiculous crowd at Christmas. I enjoy that time of year and I no longer have little ones. however, I target lower crowd times for other visits.